ConTREversy!
Posted by Joanna on 27 Mar 2006 at 01:25 pm | Tagged as: the culture
Girlfight!
Thanks to Prettier than Napleon, I’ve been alerted to a cool blog called Morphing into Mama and to a blog-style WWF pileup in response to a post she did on “false advertising” in marriage.
First of all, I think it’s great that she had this conversation in her psychopathology class and got ganged up on in response, then decided to recreate the debate for her blog audience as if that occurance was maybe an anomaly and she’d find more people that got it. well she started a firestorm with that one, with feminists’ heads exploding all over flat panel screens nationwide.
Premise: if you are cute with long hair and a svelte body and then cut off the hair and gain 40 pounds over the course of your marriage, it’s false advertising and unfair to the Hubbidy Hub Hub.
Chorus: Eek! It’s shallow! It’s slavery to have to stay cute and thin!
I totally agree with her. I have no idea why people freak out over the idea have responses like this:
“Your husband should love you no matter how much you weigh.”
well, that may be true, and maybe he’ll love you as the mother of his children, but he’s not going to be jumping your bones when he comes home from work because you’re padding around in sweats since you’ve ballooned beyond the scope of your tidy little khakis and jeans.
Knee-jerk reactions are those of squishy-headed leftism:
1. people shouldn’t feel bad about themselves ever, even if they’re perfectly capable of maintaining or improving themselves and they don’t, and
2. we no longer have to put on a frilly dress, pumps, and a fresh, pressed apron for when John comes home from The Office so he can go fuck himself if i gain a few pounds.
But MIM kicks everyone’s asses with this point:
“Don’t you find people more attractive when they exhibit self-respect?”
Ah! Yes! And shouldn’t part of loving someone involve wanting to look good for them to please them and keep them attracted? This works BOTH WAYS. I want to be hot for my long-term partner because i’m happier and randier when i feel hot, he’s happier and randier, and vice versa for him feeling that way about himself. I think it’s LESS loving of a partner to demand they love you in spite of your laziness and disrespect than it is to stay disciplined and make an effort to look good for them and for yourself.
Poor MIM had to close her comments over this because of so much hubbub:
Right now I just need to get back to being knee deep in my kids’ poop instead of other people’s shit.
As a side note I may develop later, I totally know what MIM’s talking about with the whole mom thing. From her “About”ness dealing with old ladies cooing over her child:
“Isn’t motherhood wonderful?”
In my head, my response was always, “No. It fucking sucks. I haven’t slept in over a month. My nipples are constantly dripping. I’m never alone, and all I want to do is go to Starbucks, drink a latte, and read a book. Now get out of my face before I run you down with my cart, you old bat.”
I think she’s incredibly brave to be so honest and I like her style - am glad to know motherhood doesn’t automatically turn every woman into a single-minded, gushing cheerleader that abdicates everything about herself as an individual to promote her obnoxious offspring.
[…] One a rare personal note, let me say I’m glad that my gorgeous domestic partner endorses the apparently controversial proposition that she has a responsibility to stay that way. […]
She nails it. My girlfriend and I have been dating forever and we both put on a little weight- (me more than her) and when we take the steps to look good again it always makes things more pleasant and it has alot to do with self-respect and also a desire that a person have interests outside of the television.
I think we may see in this a tweaking or a transformation of bourgois ethics and morality. I think i am going to get a blog post out of this.
Just a note about the end- I think there is some middle ground between “kids make me miserable” and sacharine laced self-abegnaiton.
i’m not sure where you’re headed with the bourgeois ethics and morality bit - sounds like a stretch.
and i sure hope there’s some middle ground between those two things.
I would have to do some research but I’m not sure how much emphasis was ever put on keeping physically attractive for one’s mate. MIddle class morality would say to dress nicely, bathe, smell nice etcc. And the emphasis was often one way.
The assumption that weight gain is related to depression in the post is interesting too. I more often chalk it up to being stuck behind a driver’s wheel and behind a desk all day and the numerous other comittments that gobble up what might be gym time (or ballroom dancing or hockey).
That’s why I think this might be a slight tweak in traditional ideas.
The link to weight gain and depression was made because the conversation took place in the context of a psychopathology class. Further, in MY case, excessive weight gain could be attributed to depresssion since I’ve never gained excessive weight before. Unfortunately, people misconstrued as this as “weight gain is ALWAYS associated with depression.” That is definitely NOT the case.
Nice post, BTW!
Thanks MIM!
Actually there are those depraved souls who find a lack of self-respect sexy. Beware reading an optimistic teleology into your aesthetic.
I guess I didn’t get the memo that I’m lacking in self respect, lazy and disrespectful because I’m overweight. These are all words from your post. Shh! Let’s keep it quiet because my husband hasn’t gotten the memo that says that he shouldn’t want to jump my bones. He’s loved me fat, fatter, pregnant, and fat and pregnant all at the same time. Works for us. If it doesn’t work for you, then that’s fine also. Live and let live.
My Great Aunt Nellie once said “I’m fat, I’m happy and all the boys love me!” I guess she didn’t get the memo either. I’m with her.
Jen, Be fair! The this is about “false advertising,” living up to the expectations you have created and encouraged, not about being fat or not. Of course, boys who like bigger girls aren’t going to be disappointed in a bigger girl. In fact, maybe women who are bigger before marriage have a kind of advantage: she can be sure her husband-to-be likes what he’s getting (and is going to get.)
Jen-
Fair point - people definitely have different preferences. I think the context of the original conversation that MIM had in class was about drastic changes in appearance that might be signals of some emotional upheaval. Beyond that, she was making a general point of consistency which I was agreeing with. So there are no missed memos!
“Don’t you find people more attractive when they exhibit self-respect?”
“maybe he’ll love you as the mother of his children, but he’s not going to be jumping your bones when he comes home from work because you’re padding around in sweats since you’ve ballooned beyond the scope of your tidy little khakis and jeans.”
“I think it’s LESS loving of a partner to demand they love you in spite of your laziness and disrespect than it is to stay disciplined and make an effort to look good for them and for yourself.”
Sorry if I misunderstood. This read to me like being overweight shows a lack of self respect than anything to do with false advertising or emotional upheaval. I really wasn’t trying to be unfair, and I’m also not very emotionally involved in the topic- just trying to represent the opposing view- so I hope you didn’t take me the wrong way. I think this is a fascinating topic and I talked to some co-workers about this. Average age was about 35-37, average length of marriage about 10-12 years. The women and men all said that they disagree with your point of view. They agreed that long term relationships, life experience and babies change your twenty-something priorities. Another comment I received was that false advertising would imply that you knew that you were going to drastically change and hid that fact. I’m sure if I polled single twenty-somethings with no children, I would have gotten drastically different responses. People’s view on topics like this are largely a function of where they are in their life.
Good thought provoking post!